Buying monopolies

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UesugiKenshin
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Buying monopolies

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http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... e=Monopole
"As soon as at least half of all major races are known, monopolies for specific resources can be purchased here. Previously, this is not possible. [It should say "this "was" not possible.]

By the possession of a monopoly of a particular resource, the production of this resource in all own systems is doubled also when buying a build list entry the pro rata cost of raw materials fall away also the monopoly owner gets all of applicable trading fees of all other empires for this specific resource. "

[Note: so it's expensive but doubled my titanium production, then later deuterium. Then I get the 15% fee rather than it just being lost so the other two AI empires are paying me instead. It also means the cost of rushing production significantly falls meaning, a very smart player knowing this, would then delay upgrades to some mines, and then after the "monopoly", then save a giant wad of cash on mining like crystals and iridium as these upgrades are very expensive.

It's not what an English speaker would call a monopoly as the other AI empires can still mine titanium and deuterium. There is nothing exclusive about my empire and titanium and deuterium mining. Instead of the word "monopoly", it should say double production in this resource.]
...
In the single player game, when you buy a monopoly, you can't lose it as the AI can't purchase a monopoly. In the multiplayer game, you can be outbid subsequently by other human players.

It's expensive. By turn #326 I had been able through trade and managing infrastructure and trying not to build fleets, but absorb them through membership, manage a high profit margin to rush infrastructure buildings. Then level up these minor race fleets by certain military buildings. And then rotate them out to protect those minor race home systems again. This made me the strongest military power way superceding the other two AI empires.

My focus was on accelerating farms to not induce famines, then when stable, then industrial might. Then research. Then all manner of mines. You manage your titanium at first by resource routes in areas that do not have it, as that is the limiting factor for higher level buildings.

I built say at eight rounds of the basic buildings, then created a resource route to allow upgrading.

Then as prices rose, then sold off natural resources to accelerate building creation. Then when the prices recovered, typcally by a 100 credit range, then sold again.

Eventually demand was high enough that waiting for the price recovery was shorter and shorter, thus the delay to sell again happened faster and faster. Then I allowed it to rise a bit more before selling. Rinse repeat.

Eventually buying the titanium monopoly for I think 150,000 credits, then deuterium for about 200,000. Duranium is about 300,000. I'm experiementing to see if it's worth doing.

In the last month, I really haven't so much played the game but experimented just to see what tactics and strategy are likely to pay off to be in a much stronger economic position than the AI.

It's twice the ore or crystals, but honestly profitability is a function of how fast the price returns to its previous normal elevel prior to me dumping that mined natural resource. The beta version seems to have the price return faster, but honestly such miniscule sales should not depress ore or crystals in such high demand. If so, then a "monopoly" ie a payment to double ore/crystal production is worth it as you easily recoup the one time fee.

It's a very different sort of game where you have to be extremely savvy on economic matters, whereas most of these 4X strategy games are not so nuanced and it's more about military conquest.

That means it's foolish and unrealistic to wage war before turn #400. All that time is about infrastructure, cashflow, understanding trade function in trade routes and mining sales and creating resource routes.

This is likely why there isn't much "internet buzz" about BotE as that is not very standard for a military space game.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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By doubling production of your mines, then you have the potential to make a lot of money. But the issue is, "Would it have been better to take that profit on titanium and deuterium, and simply reinvested in my own infrastructure to accelerate it directly?"

Maybe so as that is 350,000 credits. I (the Omega Alliance) have the strongest military and the best GDP. I feel certain I can win a research victory. The Terrans are halfway to winning a diplomatic victory.

Something peculiar is going on as the Khaoran empire was down to one system, yet somehow without colonization, they "control" some systems yet there are no type M planets there? Weird.

The Terrans can't seem to defeat them, but knocked them down, but the Khaoran empire is recovering. It seeems like the AI gets some kind of bonus after turn#300 where unaffiliated systems are being absorbed rather than colonized and capitulating or invaded.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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I was thinking about modding how many credits the buildings generate as the mining sales seem very flawed. But if you're smart and patient, then an extra 350,000 credits is possible and then makes it seem like too much profit. But how many players will wait 320+ turns to make money like that? Most would be very frustrated.

And this is on the easy level. The AI is not ruthless or getting huge bonus modifiers as it will on normal and higher levels.

If way way more sales have way less an effect on lowering price, the game would be better.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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As the Omega, it took hundreds of turns, but I finally had monopolies in titanium, deuterium, and duranium. And was making as much as 500,000 credits every five turns by selling off my doubled production. So yeah, it's worth it. For game testing I thought about crystals and iridium too, but the issue was imminent war with the Khaoran but likely a defensive war they could not invade the Omega and win. So I could have cornered the market.

Then with the gold of Midas himself, then could have easily handled high upkeep and huge standing fleets, and taken the Khaoran and then sabotaged the naive Terrans. What was crazy was the Terrans so bady wanted a non-agression pact, then a defensive pact, then an alliance...that they gaveme the ore and crystals which I was partially selling to buy the monopoly and so able to have enormous amouts of credits. It was so ironic.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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You have to be a very patient diplomatic player to pull this off and have a research goal turned on. The Terrans try to get a diplomatic victory and failed, but nearly got a research victory. I snatched a research victory by a few turns only. Then my real plan was a scotched earth total conquest victory.

The Omega stink at getting minor races to join them. But endless money and a leap forward in tech, and two lucky breaks getting the Adamar and the Xibren fleets, then training them (leveling them up with warrior buildings), put me way ahead.

Meanwhile the Terrans and Khaoran were obsessed with destroying each other.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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As far as my experience went trying this and many other 350+ event turns, the minor race will sometimes attack better colony ships and may certainly attack scouts entering their system. So for the best diplomacy, you make a lot of spare base colony ships that do terraforming and act as first non-threatening contact.

The minor races, on their own, will not invade your systems. But if members of a major race, then possibly will be directed as the first shock troops are their ships are initially better. But that happened after 300+ turns as they would rather use them for defense.

The major races will send probes of transports to set up outposts and starbases and send lightly armed colony ships (we were just here to start inncent colonies), yet invade major race territory with starbases level 2-3 which is flat out suicidal.

This means you can build defensively and pretty late, thus minimizing upkeep costs and focusing infrastructure.

I had an Adamar and Xibren fleet (both leveled up) and a single three heavy cruiser fleet..it was enough for 58 systems as the others were guarded by outposts and then upgraded to starbases.

I planned a more extensive test, but I am restarting again due to energy micromangaement issues which is terribly confusing.

Try this with the Rotharians and you likely will absorb more minor races (and likely fleets) so be even stronger for the first elimination nof the weaker of the two who have been fighting (as you gaied the other's perfect trust). Then backstab the remaining naive opponent.

You might even draw them in by pulling some stunts so they declare war and take the moral hit.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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A TON of conflict could be eliminated by "hailing minor and major races instead of stumbling into systems. You would hail them outside the sector.

A 20 light year sector may have 12 solar systems in it in fact, all stacked along the Z axis. So 98% is empty space. There is only a limited need for empty sectors and all systems likely have nine valuable planets in every sector as they are from different solar systems. 20 light years is 4.5 times the distance to Alpha Centauri. That is a huge amount of space time.

An ideal game really wouldn't exist until 400+ turns as it takes that long to just get established to do a war. Battles really wouldn't happen so much as skirmishes between a ship to ship. Fleet battles really take lots of expensive resources, so ideally you don't begin in turn#1 as most want to fight so 400 turns later.

Blowout games are not fun for anyone. You want to defeat a strong opponent on your terms rather than a hothead extraterrestrial firing potshots. That's silly.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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After three weeks plus examining the game, day in and day out, BotE has a HUGE untapped potential to be so much more. With no graphic changes or soundeffects, and just storytelling, minor tweaks of sabotage, and maybe a little more money at the start, this game would rock.

Most people though would never spend 300-400 turns building the economy. Try the beta version too. You sign up for it.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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Doubling production by monopolies ends up being worthless as:
1. There is a cap of 125,000 on resources so yeah maybe your mines are way more efficient, but storage is limited.
2. Realize that you likely will play against one enemy (and that being the Khaoran due to sabotage issues). If you spent all that money on warships, troop transports, starbases as waystations to increase your range and protect sectors, and troops versus on a monopoly, well, the Khaoran would end up clobbering you.

The Khaoran are not going to build.monopolies. While focusing on money, they are out for your blood.

You don't need monopolies. See the saving money topic and the resource route topic. I routinely am gaining 3.5 million credits in turn 670+. If I wanted to, I could make armadas and troops transprts and crush all alien races. I choose not too.
Zuletzt geändert von UesugiKenshin am Dienstag 9. Juni 2020, 19:05, insgesamt 2-mal geändert.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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Now if there were a software revision that raised the cap on storage to 250,000 per resource per sector, then monopolies might pay off.
Zuletzt geändert von UesugiKenshin am Dienstag 9. Juni 2020, 19:03, insgesamt 1-mal geändert.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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You can duplicate the effect of doubling mine production...by simply doubling your mines. But upgrades are ridiculous. What I suggest is create 4 (like crystals) and then upgrade to level 7, and then making 4 new ones.

However all this ends up doing is say you sell off from 125,000 units to 50,000. You get a ton of profit in the late game as crystals might sell for 1800 per 100 units. So with more level 7 mines your mining efficiency is better and so you can mine more crystals per turn but nothing lifts the 125,000 storage cap. It would actually be smarter to have 4 Level 7 crystal mines in one sector and 4 Level 7 crystal mines in another sector as combined that's 250,000 units to avoid the storage cap.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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By routinely creating 4 Level 7 mines of all resources (except deritium), I can make so much money across the galaxy that I can effectively buy whatever I want. And have gigantic caches of resources in every sector. So I can manipulate the price and sell when it's extremely high and still have lots of caches that can sit and grow (to 125,000), then sell again.

The thing is most players don't wait so long to wage war as that is a solid month of just building.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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IF it were an actual monopoly, then I would be the sole distributor and could set the price or refuse to sell. See? But it's not that way.

That would stymie other major race's upgrades to infrastructure and likely they would war against me for locking up their economies.

Understand what BotE is offering you as it's not a monopoly.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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Just because I understand how to manipulate the resource trading, and so manage to create vast caches of all the resources in many colonies, and make millions, does not mean everyone can do so.

I can try to communicate how, but when some players hear, "cashflow and economics", and they immediately grow bored. I'm trying to think of a brief way to convey a very simple goof-proof methodology so even a young teenaged player can do this.

Most players are interested in waging war and understanding the difference in armor and weaponry. Maybe 1% have tactical and strategic brilliance, and so they intuit game mechanics to pursue and engage the enemy, by the fastest means, by the least number of moves. They can't always communicate how they do so.

There are heafty economic costs to gain a monopoly (doubling the mining production of a resource and gaining commisions), so the same ones with economic brilliance or alien race specific ability ie the Heyoun are apt to be the ones to achieve this by ordinary means.

The Terrans, being innately more diplomatic, could use that same money to bribe or better offer gifts, and so gain entire fleets as they subvert minor alien races. It's not just new membership to gain income and the current minor alien fleet. Long term that means access to minor alien ship technology, so they can customize ships. If those minor aliens have cloaking or some extremely beneficial weaponry, the money spent can be a huge boost in fleet strength. Their ship chasis may be more manueverable than their own alien ships, thus a monumental improvement as large ships are by default cumbersome not manueverable.
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Re: Buying monopolies

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In my latest Omega game, I bought monopolies as I had millions just accumulating in the treasury, so why buy them?
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