round about BotE for Android

Discussions about BotE for Android should take place here

Welchen weg sollte ich wählen?

BotE so gut wie möglich zu Portieren mit der erforderlichen kleinen Änderungen in der Benutzeroberfläche um es berührungsfreundlich zu machen
14
88%
Ein neues Spiel erstellen mit eventueller Benutzung von einigen Ressourcen aus BotE (wenn ich dafür die Erlaubnis bekomme). Hier denke ich zuerst an Planeten, Sterne usw.
1
6%
Ein komplett neues Spiel zu erstellen, es würde vielleicht BotE und BoF ähneln (z.B. will ich unbedingt eine gitterartige Karte) aber sonst würde es sich anders verhalten.
1
6%
 
Insgesamt abgegebene Stimmen: 16
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
phpbb forum styles
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

In Google Chrome in the Android version, as long as you don't log in and make English comments, then the app recognizes the German language and does an adequate job of translating the text into English. I routinely just read as a guest to read old posts to try to reveal old hints. However once logged in, translations are often stymied.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
blotunga
Flottenkapitän
Flottenkapitän
Beiträge: 849
Registriert: Montag 26. Mai 2014, 15:05

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von blotunga »

It would need some polish, so max I could push it to the beta channels. However I'm not sure when I'll have time to do it. Hopefully during the weekend/next week.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

blotunga hat geschrieben: Donnerstag 2. April 2020, 09:46 It would need some polish, so max I could push it to the beta channels. However I'm not sure when I'll have time to do it. Hopefully during the weekend/next week.
What wonderful news as that vastly exceeds my expectations! In the interim, I will make up some more save game campaigns that people can try and document game concepts like ship and troop types by major race. I also plan to delve into the minor race techtrees which are not accessible via the research database screens.

In the Star Trek Enterprise series, Commander Archer discusses having the Vulcan database the NX-01 crew can utilize when exploring and meeting new races in the Pre-Federation days. It's a limited galactic anthropology resource so the Terrans understand the various warp capable races. In a way, explaining the documentation is like that.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Vulcan_database

Some players may not want to know as it's effectively a spoiler whereas obviously commanders would desperately need such details as if affects diplomacy versus conflict resolution. The Nausicaans are one such example.
https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Nausicaan

Spatial anomalies are included in the Vulcan database as their primary mission is exploration regarding stellar cartography. However it may be wise to limit the details on anomalous entities and only briefly illustrate that direct combat may be ill-advised. Klingons would respond in far different ways than Cardassians versus the Federation.

It's rather like Private Hudson's response in the Aliens film. "Is this a standup fight or a bughunt?" That would make Commander Picard shutter.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=5EmqHXf5O5s
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

https://bitbucket.org/sarkanyi/bote-lib ... r/android/
This seems to be the open source code for the Android multiplayer version.

I'm guessing that one way this Android multiplayer app mentions signing in google and using the Google Games Play app is to facilitate multiplayer and also boost the game at the same time as the Android OS notoriously runs many apps regardless if the user wants this to happen.

Otherwise if you use Clean Booster and turn off the wifi, then you can shut down most apps, then boost BotE from within that app. I think it runs better this way ie it's more stable.

You mentioned before using VLC player to run music mp3s in the background. There also is the Play Music app in Android which scans the drive and plays what you have stored. I'm playing old legacy Star Trek mp3s from Trekcore. It really enhances the game.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

On turn #306, the solar date is 321738. Using this stardate calculator:
http://www.hillschmidt.de/gbr/sternenzeit.htm

That would equal September 27, 2644, Time: 02:35:31

Instead, based on the available technology, it's probably 2266 at best which is Star Trek the original series. Even that is a stretch based on available weapons technology. It could be 2200 or so.

It's interesting to show a solar date, but it's clearer to just specify if it's a quarterly system and the Gregorian calendar.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gregorian_calendar

It's a function of warp speed travel and the rate of expansion setting to synch up with a reasonable amount of time to traverse the galaxy based on available technology and the year according to canon and the available ships. And here are the Klingon technology levels.
Screenshot_2020-04-08-19-54-27.png
They actually only can create these ships so far.
Screenshot_2020-04-08-19-57-28.png
It's plausible they could make better ships with tailored different technology focus regarding multiple settings rather than a balanced approach.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

Here's my latest turn #341. Consider the rate of expansion is normal and you can see the Klingon boundary of how far they can traverse from their homesystem (Q'onos). To me the distance is at best the first or second year of The Original Series so 2266, but a case could be made that it's not far enough of a range given issues with Federation expansion.
Screenshot_2020-04-08-23-54-45.png
The solar date is 334893 which if plugged in and converted using the above link:
http://www.hillschmidt.de/gbr/sternenzeit.htm
November 22, 2657, Time: 22:40:48

That is a gap of 391 years. Given the distance and range of expansion it's after Enterprise and likely even before Christopher Pike was at the helm. But the terraforming is advanced so maybe split the difference.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... e=Raumzeit
The timescale is variable from the beginning at 2121 AD and 2 years per turn to at some point 2 weeks per turn. It's impossible to compare the solar date to the star date.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Galactic Map settings

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

On these maxed out map array settings of 40x40 at 100% stars, the map should be full of stars.
bote0007.png
bote0007.png (7.75 KiB) 4508 mal betrachtet
But it's not.
Der Dateianhang bote0007.png existiert nicht mehr.
A screencap results in a pic bigger than 1 meg so I can't display it in line, but you can see that there are many empty spaces. I think it's a bug in the program. I'm going to increase star density and see which number results in the highest star density on an irregular map. I bet most players do not set it that high, but that would actually reflect a Star Trek map that is quite full and consider that a 40x40 map at 100% density is about the size of the Federation, Romulans, and Klingons only so a small map not even showing all of the alpha and beta quadrants, so there is no room for six empires and the edge of the gamma quadrant.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

In 1974 or so, guys used to get together and drink beer and eat pizza and play Avalon Hill war games and later Talisman or Ace of Aces (the WW1 book gogfighting game), and later Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. That is what BotE feels like...like playing a military strategy board game like Diplomacy. It's dressed up with better graphics but it sure feels like rolling dice of many sizes (as was the case with AD&D) or playing a WW2 replay of a famous battle with some veterans.

It's nostalgic and so doesn't feature the stimuli of computer games. And probably why it's more suited as a multiplayer game with chat and goading your friends because they screwed up and made a poorly thought out move.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
blotunga
Flottenkapitän
Flottenkapitän
Beiträge: 849
Registriert: Montag 26. Mai 2014, 15:05

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von blotunga »

I didn't yet had time to do a multiplayer build, and I also remembered that on android it wouldn't help much if you don't have multiple devices around (except maybe if you want to hassle with playing a turn, saving, the loading as a next race). Multiplayer is LAN only for the moment and chat isn't yet implemented (it was on the to-do, but didn't had time). Next weekend is a long one, maybe I can find some time for it.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

Hotseat is more valuable than genuine multiplayer. Any software updates are appreciated when you find the time. Hotseat enabled makes an advanced save game in turn #200 simple.

I'd like to make some modifications in the data files but need some guidance how to recompile the apk on the Android. Then there would be a mod where the economy is better (many buildings produce income) and sabotage is a much later weapon (many techlevel requirements). Likely in the mod, fewer minor races would dislike major races too so trade could more easily be established (by adjusting the racial data).

I don't need editors and am comfortable changing the text files directly using notepad.

It's easy to extract the apk. It's easy to read and edit the data files (the wiki in German explains this good enough). Then you are supposed to delete the old specific file and insert the edited file, then compile the apk. The last part is very unclear.

You don't want many compiled apks out there, but ways to read different data files so the original is this way, or then they can play a mod this way. That is how Civ 3 and later was designed.

Ideally the different mods would be attached datafiles that are read from new versions and included in the next update so people can try them. There are no graphics or sound changes, only text edits, so no copyright issues at all.

This way people have alternative ways of playing. BotE is great as is, but needs some tweaking as even on "easy" it's too difficult. A better economy and no sabotage until after turn #600 is quite different and certainly easier.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

The minor races are so well created that some would make interesting alternative major races. That is a lot of work though to create new ships and troops as I'm not an artist. But I've thought about a much better mod that would still only allow six empires but two of the existing warrior races who already have configured ships.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

If I'm only changing three data files with text edits, and if replacing these and recompiling is simple, then I can write a procedure so anyone who wants to play my mod can use the attachements I upload to do so. It can even be hosted at moddb so you won't have to mess with it.

These would be minimods where things like rebalancing the ship data or the troops data. Or even doing something where the Terrans are played like the Khayrin and the Cartarer are the good guys but have the exact same ships. You know a mirror universe.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

The more I play BotE, the more I can think of ways to make the game more fun and unique as a space exploration game. A whole series of dynamic events could fire regardless of what the human player does, but certainly when the player is playing their turn. Things could alter the modifiers in small ways for the various crew of vessels and on individual planets. Not strongly but subtle changes that would make the game far more novel instead of largely being about micromanaging. Then maybe in nearby sectors close to planets, then it truly feels like exploring the galaxy. Events happen due to be near the sector or in the sector.

A 12 light year star map. Look at the x,y,z axis. Not how many solar systems.
12lys.gif
12lys.gif (7.5 KiB) 4418 mal betrachtet
A sector being 20 light years, across the x,y, and z axis plus time, is VAST. Alpha Centauri is 4.423 light years from our sun (Sol). When people think of that, they think in reference to a flat plane which is totally incorrect. So imagine 4.5 times that distance.

Making all sectors with nine planets and a star makes perfect sense to better scale it. And what that instantly fixes is sufficient space for six empires as then routinely there are enough planets is a system (as it's representative of multiple solar systems yet only showing the nine significant planets in that 20 light years of space time.

The player sees a tiny square when it's like a huge deck of cards and any planet, sun, phenomena, and vessels could on any of those cards. It's not it at all like a solar system in an imaginary flat 2D plane.

It seems like the best way would be minimods attached to the main game as loadable options given the real chore of recompiling the apk so Google Play's protection scheme does not cause loading issues. The only way I can run programs on my tablet is directly through the Google Play store. The minimods only change the text data files.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Benutzeravatar
UesugiKenshin
Admiral
Admiral
Beiträge: 3561
Registriert: Dienstag 31. März 2020, 03:51

Re: round about BotE for Android

Beitrag von UesugiKenshin »

There are various ways we could mod BotE, but none of them are ideal versus the ease of modding a computer version.

Many Android tablets have restrictions loading apk files from anywhere besides the Google Play store. So, there are zero issues with a direct download. But if you extract the apk (unzip it or alter the obb which has the graphics and sounds), then it won't load.

1. So we could supply text datafiles and maybe they get a release through Google Play with the standard apk through optional loads in the program. Or the developer allows this kind of mod as a downloadable link (an alternative apk) on the same page as the official BotE at the Google Play store. The former requires program changes. The later requires no program changes just a link (similar to the beta version link).

2. We rezip the changes and rename it with the apk extension. Then only those folks who can sideload apks can use the file. That likely means downloading the apk to a PC, and hooking up to the USB port through the device's ADB port. This is allowed on some tablets. Alternatively there is a wireless version that works but only on rooted tablets.

3. Some tablet owners can go into their security settings and allow "unknown sources" and run any 3rd party apk once that security setting is toggled. This is very hit and miss.

Only option #1 works for me and works for anyone consistently. It also means there aren't alternative apk versions of BotE which is not a good thing as someone could use copyrighted material and repack an apk which is a bad situation for the developer.

I hope we can do option #1.
Minor Race Database http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... r_(Minors)
Minor Race Ships http://birth-of-the-empires.de/wiki/ind ... nen_Völker
Chrome and Opera autotranslates German.
Antworten

Zurück zu „BotE for Android - Discussions“